PTO problem? Gearbox noise Super major 1963

[Aleš63]

Hi, today I successfully replaced the bearings and seals in the PTO housing. Now all that's left is to wait for the needle bearings for the gear wheel. The needle bearings are supposed to arrive tomorrow, so hopefully I'll be able to start up the tractor and test it over the weekend. Aleš





Before applying the lock ring.

[Billy26F5]

Looking good. Hope it works correctly now.
Sandy

[Aleš63]

Hey guys, so over the weekend I replaced the gearbox and completely overhauled the PTO housing. I have to say, it was really hard work putting the two halves of the tractor back together again. It took me quite a while to get the shaft to fit into the clutch plates. For quite some time now, I've thought that there was a problem with the gear stick, namely that there was some play in it. I tightened all the screws connected to the gear stick, but then I noticed a screw inside the housing that has some play, but I don't know if that's normal. I would appreciate some advice. Thanks a lot, Aleš
https://youtube.com/shorts/0cKcv0XYT7A? ... 5jAQp828xd

[Billy26F5]

That's not a screw, it's a dowel, part no. N-7221. These wear badly, the housing and lever do too. Not a big deal, and it can wait for a test run, I'll measure it tomorrow so you can make a new one and fill in the wear in the housing and lever, at a suitable moment. The ball on the end of the lever looks good, but you do get sloppyness there too. As already said, not an urgent job, and actually many aren't fixed and still work as sloppy as you can imagine, but you can take it up and feel it works better, even just replacing the dowel will make a big difference.
Sandy

[Aleš63]

Hi Sandy, thank you very much. Have you ever seen what a complete double clutch adjustment kit looks like? I have the opportunity to buy one, but I don't know if it's complete. Thank you very much.

[Billy26F5]

Wow you're a lucky boy! Even if not complete go for it, it's well worth having. I see it's an American one. The tool consists of the following parts: T.7502, T.7502-1, T.7502-2. T.7502-2 includes T.7502-2/aa, T.7502-2/b, T.7502-2/d, T.7502-2/e. In old numbers 7502 (consisting of 7502/1, 7502/2 and 7502/3), 7502-1, Tr/D 7502 (consisting of Tr/D 7502/1, Tr/D 7502/2, Tr/D 7502/3 and Tr/D 7502/4). In American tools it's NE-7502.
You seem to have the Dexta version, which adds T.7502-3/a, T.7502-3/b, T.7502-3/d and extra locating pegs, only it's the American version NDA-7502, with NDA-7502-5A and NDA-7502-8A. You'll need to see what the seller says but from what I can see you're missing the setting blocks NDA-7502-8A. Without them the tool is not able to adjust the levers correctly. I'm afraid it's all a bit confusing but there's not a lot of information on tools. The usual ones come from V.L. Churchill, the American ones from Nuday, they might be able to help with knowing what is meant to be included. A further note is that there are a couple of changes to the American tool required to use it on Dexta's, you'll need to check that when you get it.
Sandy

[Billy26F5]

Just adding the sizes of N-7221.

Sandy

[Aleš63]

Hi Sandy, thanks a lot for the information. Well, I'll see if I buy the adjustment tool. Do you have plans for the whole assembly that could be used to make it for the Major double clutch? Thanks a lot. Aleš

[Billy26F5]

Unfortunately no, but don't let that put you off getting it, for there are many Dexta's that need that tool and it'll make it easier to measure for those who don't have such a tool. There is a drawing of the clutch tool in the manual which I added some details here https://www.fordsontractorpages.nl/phpb ... 835#p58835 but they're not accurate enough as it didn't work, a real tool is much better for such measurements, and then it can be easier to adjust one of these clutches just on the flywheel for people without the tool. The usual tool (the Churchill one) only had slight differences between Major's and Dexta's with most parts being common, so you might be able to make yourself the missing parts. Just to add that T.7502-1 is a spring compressor, an ordinary valve one will do the job fine.
Sandy

[Aleš63]

Hi Sandy, so yesterday I started the tractor and turned on the PTO, and everything was running smoothly until I started driving and heard a different sound coming from the transmission.... I have no idea what it could be :/ The tractor does this even when I press the clutch pedal. It's very disappointing. Aleš

https://youtu.be/3vvpKCzUnzc?si=ZFqB0Bd1ZPMCIFyS

[Billy26F5]

I understand it only sounds when the wheels move, am I right? If so it's either in the rear of the gearbox or the rear axle, if it didn't make such a noise before it's probably the gearbox. See if different gears make a difference, with high-low in neutral. Did you adjust the handbrake as speciified by Ford? I suspect it's a bad bearing somewhere, but could be a damaged gear too.
Sandy

[Aleš63]

Hi, I have no choice but to start repairs this weekend. I assembled the handbrake according to the diagram in the catalog and photos from the internet. Is there a specific procedure that needs to be followed? I saw from the side that the handbrake works fine. The tractor makes these noises even when no gear is engaged. But I'm sure it's coming from the gearbox. I suspect it could be the gear wheel that drives the differential. I'll try to fix it over the weekend, and if I hear any new noises or can't fix it, I'll take the tractor to the scrapyard. Just kidding.
I'm sure I did everything right when assembling the transmission, so it's 90% likely to be the gear wheel between the gearbox and the differential. Anyway, thanks for the advice.

[Billy26F5]

I suggest you go through this and see if you did the same (excepting the special tools): https://www.fordson.se/4B_V%E4xell%E5da ... 16-035.pdf
I say about the handbrake because there's a plate in an unexpected location (between the idler gear and casting) and the adjustment is fairly precise (margin of 25 thou). If you're not sure about this you can have a look through the selector plate apperture, but there's not a lot you can do there without taking the gearbox out again. I still don't know if it makes noise when the wheels don't move, but if it does it supports it being further forward than the transmission large gear which only moves if the wheels move. From the way you've spoken about it I don't think you had it before which completely rules out it being in the rear axle.
Sandy

[Aleš63]

When the tractor is stationary and the engine is running, it doesn't make this noise. Everything runs perfectly smoothly. The noise only occurs when the tractor is moving. I have assembled the handbrake correctly and yes, I have a plate between the gear wheel and the casting. And when I look through the side opening, the handbrake is working properly. We drain the oil from the gearbox and I lift the rear of the tractor so that I can turn the rear wheels and find out exactly where the problem is. Aleš

[Aleš63]

Hi Sandy, after quite some time, I'm posting an update. After assembling and disassembling the gearbox twice, I found out that I probably have the wrong new handbrake wheel. I found out that two different types were manufactured, one for disc brakes and one for drum brakes. So I'll probably have to get my gear wheel repaired because it wasn't in the gearbox I bought because the owner before me needed the gear wheel. Yesterday, I took the wheel to a friend to have him weld it in a few places because the middle part was moving. Unfortunately, he probably welded it upside down? (In the photos I'm attaching to the text, it looks like it's correct.) Because now it's as if the back side is the same, but when I turned the wheel over before welding, one side was slightly longer. Does anyone have a photo of what the wheel should look like when it's undamaged?
Or does it matter what kind of wheel is there? I don't know why it's making the sound that was in the video. I replaced all the gearbox bearings, so it must be a problem with the gear wheel, which is also evident in the video. Thank you very much, Aleš

The gear wheel I bought is marked
EIADKN-7143

[Billy26F5]

A new reverse idler was introduced with the NP, but it was completely interchangeable as an assembly with the previous type unchanged from the Fordson N. The change is in fixing the hub, the later gear having circlips, both should be a press fit. The recess in the gear should face forward, so the original gear has been running the wrong way round. The hub should protrude only slightly at the front, if loose it'll fit suitably by itself although it will suffer from clunking in use. Don't weld it, the heat treatments are very complex and important. Looks like the repro part as usual is not to exact Ford specs. The bush should be next to the gear, not halfway along. The two part numbers are E1ADDN-7141 and N-7141E. E1ADKN-7141B is for tractors without a handbrake. E1ADDN-7143B is the bush for the non-handbrake gear, N-7143C is the bush for your one. I would suggest you check the shaft for the idler, it should protrude 1.2" and be smooth. The old bush shouldn't be reused, it's scored and probably too loose; not too happy about that hub either.
Sandy

[Aleš63]

Hi, thanks for your reply I'm trying to find an original gear wheel, but I don't think I'll be able to find one. I'm sure that the noise coming from the gearbox is caused by this gear. Now I don't know whether to use it anyway so I can finally put the tractor back together. Unfortunately, I probably bought the most broken Super Major available I'd like to put it back together and have some peace and quiet for a while. Thanks for the advice, Aleš.

[Aleš63]

I'll measure the shaft tomorrow, but it looked to be in great condition, just like the rest of the gearbox. It's just this one gear that's causing me so many problems...

[Billy26F5]

Try putting the bush in the right position and see if it's better. Possibly worth checking the alignment of the shaft and while you're there the reverse pinion bush and the main upper shaft pinion for play and general condition (these both mesh with the reverse idler). If that doesn't sort it then a look further back might be worth it.
Sandy

[Aleš63]

Hi Sandy, I have a question... I got an offer to buy this gear wheel for a handbrake, but it seems that the center gear wheel is loose. Is this wheel supposed to be loose or firmly connected to the large gear wheel? I thought it was supposed to be firmly connected to the large gear wheel because the new gear wheel I bought is firmly connected to the large gear wheel, but the original one I had there was loose, and the one I have the opportunity to buy now is also loose. Aleš