Poor starting technique?

[pbufton]

Hi all

haven't been on the forums for a couple of weeks, after I figured out the wiring problem with help of a few off this forum (thanks ) Its been nice to have it just parked in the shed knowing it works as It should.

However, I've been looking at many vids on youtube of Fordson Dexta cold starts, and mine just doesnt seem to compare.

I've got a new heater plug on order, and awaiting delivery of a fuel tank tap with primer, and the pipe which goes from the tank to the inlet. Up until now, i've used a blowtorch flame pointing into the air filter tub while cranking, and yet the tractor takes a good 30 seconds of cranking to get it to fire Watching the video's on youtube makes me think my dexta is just a crap starter for some reason? Or does the excess fuel igniting in the manifold work magic to these stubborn things?

Engine doesn't smoke at all while running, a touch of blue smoke on overrun but what tractor doesn't do that

Are some just really poor starters? Im starting to think about a rebuild kit, and see if that helps?

[pbufton]

Forgot to add, I have fitted a new battery, new wiring loom and new start motor brushes, so the engine is cranking quite quickly

[Bensdexta]

Wait till you have a working heater, then see how she starts.

Should start with heat only unless it's below freezing.

[Cvans]

I can tell you this about mine. If I just use the heater it is not real eager to start. If I use the heater and the primer it starts up and runs just fine. If the temperature is below 40 degrees F. I use an engine heater and it starts like summer even when it is below 0 degrees F.

[PghBill]

Make sure there is an atomizer assembly in the manifold to connect to.If there isn't , you'll end up sucking fuel thru the primer line causing your engine to load up on fuel.
Bill

[sky blue]

when the dexta was first build an sold from new they where fitted with
the primer / heater set up, this was for starting first thing and when the
where they were cold, after this it should start without using the heater
so this would be the first thing to get sorted as ben said , if it still is giving trouble
then the head valves tappets ect are all good then it may be time to start thinking
about the bottom end
im probley teaching my granny to suck eggs but do all the smaller things
before going the whole hog and rebuilding sky blue

[pbufton]

One the engine is warm, is starts firs tturn of the key all day long..the engine seems a bit tappety on one or two cylinders so thats a job for the new year i think.

The new heater plug had been delivered, I just hadnt seen it

So today fitter it, and ran the pipe from the atomizer to a syringe-full of diesel (Havent got the correct fuel tank tap yet)

Whats the correct procedure? Heat for 40 secs then prime the fuel? i gave it a squirt of fuel and pressed the starter lever, it turns over for a couple of seconds, has the odd splutter of life then nothing. On the 3rd prime and a bit of heat, she fired A lot less fuss than using the blowtorch and almost burning out the starter motor every time.

Although the squirt of fuel is more like a large dribble/stream of fuel into the inlet. Can these atomiser things still be purchased new? Im awaiting Agriline to get the fuel taps in stock currently

[Brian Cox]

Went today to start mine, 1962 Super Dexta. No heat ,primer or anything just starter approx 5 turns and started. Temp. here today 8 degrees.
Is the fuel getting through ok? The only time mine has not started was when after renewing fuel filter I forgot to bleed the pump.Could it be needing to be bled? I would bleed it anyway just in case. Hope you have a very happy dexta new year.

[PghBill]

Although the squirt of fuel is more like a large dribble/stream of fuel into the inlet. Can these atomiser things still be purchased new? Im awaiting Agriline to get the fuel taps in stock currently

The only atomizer still available is whats called the domestic model which requires you to manually open it when starting and close it when started. ( Agriline part # 7213 ) The export model was a little check valve that was put on the models shipped to the U.S. It is no longer available anywhere. The atomizer will create a fine spray of fuel that ignites very readily.
Bill

[pbufton]

thanks all

yeah the one thats on it has a little tap on too.

Do i heat for 40 secs then prime the pump 3 times?

[PghBill]

Here is the starting directions copied straight from the owners manual:

TO START THE ENGINE WHEN COLD

1. Ensure that the fuel supply tap is turned on. The main supply is available when the supply tap is unscrewed two turns.
2. Check that the main gear lever is in the neutral position.
3. Ensure that the stop control on the control panel is pushed right in.
4. Insert the main control key in the switch, turn to the right and check that both-warning lights become illuminated.
5, Move the throttle lever in a clockwise direction to slightly more than the half open position.
6. Press the induction primer button once only to inject a small quantity of fuel on to the heater plug and depress the heater button for forty seconds.
7. Depress the clutch pedal fully and, with the heater button still depressed, operate the starter motor by pushing the starter control lever downwards. Pump the primer button two or three times as the engine is being turned over by the starter motor, when the engine should start.
8. Release the starter control lever and the heater button immediately the moment the engine starts and adjust the engine speed by means of the throttle lever. If the engine does not start, wait thirty seconds and try again. Always ensure that all moving parts come to rest before attempting to re-engage the starter motor otherwise damage may occur.
Bill

[Cvans]

Good information Bill. Thanks for posting it.

[PghBill]

Chris,
Got that info right on this site.
When you go to http://www.fordsontractorpages.nl/ there is a dark blue band across the top of the page.
Run your cursor over The Dexta
A drop down menu will appear that takes you to the owners manual, parts manual etc
Lots of good info
Bill

[marcusgs]

The heater/fuel atomizer should make the world of difference to starting. It's effectively like putting your blow lamp directly into the intake manifold, while starting which is significantly increasing the temperature of the air drawn into the engine.
If your heater/atomizer isn't working, it is much much kinder to remove the heater plug and put the blow lamp in there while starting.
This does require skillful use of the two hands that you were blessed with, and as soon as the engine fires, you MUST replace the heater plug, otherwise the engine will rev it's self to destruction!

[Cvans]

Hi Bill:
Mine came with the original owners manual but as I remember the starting sequence is different. Hold the heater for 40 seconds (longer if it's really cold) then give two or three pumps on the primer and start. I like the idea you listed of pumping the primer as the engine is turning over. Makes good sense to me.

[PghBill]

Looked everywhere in the world for a "export" model atomizer, even tractor graveyards. No luck !
Didn't want the inconvenience of getting on and off to open and close the tap on the "domestic" model atomizer. Plus with my front loader it would be a pain.
So I installed a heater plug from a Ferguson that has a bi-metallic fuel valve built in that opens when the heater plug gets hot and closes when it cools. Went a little farther and added a time delay relay that keeps my heater plug on for 60 seconds after i hit the heater button. Frees up my left hand to hit the primer while cranking. Works great !
Bill


"Babe, the Blue Ox"

[Bensdexta]

Sounds good!!

[ol'Blue]

This is one of the most resourceful communities I have had the pleasure to know..... Well done......Its good to see the team from around the world helping keep this old Iron running.....


dave

[Cvans]

Sounds like an excellent remedy Bill. Congratulations. I especially like the idea of a timed holding relay. Cheap and simple upgrade. Now you have me thinking

[pbufton]

Bill, went to the dexta today as had a few piles of offcuts of hedging to move to burn

Still havent got my hands on the correct tank tap to plumb the pipe in which is going to the atomizer, so i've plumbed in a temporary (large) syringe and use that in place of the primer at the minute.

Primed, heat for 40 secs, wind on the starter. Nothing except plumes of smoke. I wait 30 secs and heat again, wind over the engine, whilst winding over give the syringe 2 fairly good squirts of fuel, and straight away it fired. Admittedly, I've seen somewhere that whilst winding over the engine, move the throttle lever quikly from idle to flat out many times helps?

Would not believe the difference that bit of extra fuel makes combined with the heat

Cant wait to get hold of the last few bits to complete the cold start process

[PghBill]

Chris, It'll only cost ya about $15.00 and a little time. Keeps ya from being an octopus while your are doing a cold start. If you need help drop me a line

Dave, I must agree with you. Sure have learned a whole lot since I joined this forum. Seems like there is always someone willing to help you out. I love this place!!

Mr. pbufton, Sounds like you are finally getting that Dexta going. Got your wiring all straightened out and now with the new fuel tap you should be good to go.

Bill

[pbufton]

Still eagerly awaiting Agriline to get this fuel tap in stock..

it lead me to think - why is this tractor such a crap starter? i get lots of smoke on turn over, but she just sounds dead. im wondering whether reseating the valves and honing out the bores/new piston rings help? Surely cant hurt.

Short of that, will sell it and get myself a super dexta instead.

[bobby]

Still eagerly awaiting Agriline to get this fuel tap in stock..

it lead me to think - why is this tractor such a crap starter? i get lots of smoke on turn over, but she just sounds dead. im wondering whether reseating the valves and honing out the bores/new piston rings help? Surely cant hurt.

Short of that, will sell it and get myself a super dexta instead.

i looked every place for primer tap if you log onto dunloptractorspares.co.uk they have them in stock.you have to lift the tank up to get the tap on

[marcusgs]

Hi.
Any tractor which is 40-50 years old and has done a reasonable amount of work 5000+ hours will struggle starting, especially when cold i.e less than 5c.
Your Dexta will start easily with the correct, and working starting equipment.
Equally, if you unscrew the glow plug from the inlet manifold, and point your blowlamp in there, and start it, it will start easily.
Just a word of warning if you do this, you need to screw the glow plug back in INSTANTLY as it fires, or it will rev it's self to oblivion!

If you sell it and buy a Super Dexta chances are it will be similar, without the correct cold start kit.

That said, I have just rebuilt mine completely, and it seems to start well without any heat even when cold (2c)

No doubt as it beds in it will need some heat

[Vulgunx]

When i 1st got my dexta she was on sniff couldn't start without being hooked up to the landrover so she will turn over faster i will give her 3pumps of fuel and 40seconds of heat then went for a start i kept doing that 2-3 times a week letting her run for about 30-40 minutes letting her heat up(So she tops hunting) so she is warm ever since then she is getting better and better at starting just takes time